Bards and Barrels
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Bards and Barrels
S4 Ep. 7 - Mailbag Time!
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It's time for the first mail bag of 2026! Listen in as the guys discuss this editions slate of mind crunching questions.
Hey the opening crack, the double.
SPEAKER_03Love it. It's beautiful. It's beautiful, you guys. A foamer. Oh man. Oh man.
SPEAKER_01Oh man.
SPEAKER_03Well, it's time to explode. It's okay for another episode of Bards and Barrels. Uh, tonight is a mailbag. Alice, are you excited? No! Always excited. Always nervous. I'm never excited about this. I am I mean it's gotten to the point where Phil even suggested tonight that you guys need to bring questions to randomly throw in here. That's what we've gotten to. It's not that bad, is it? We might make them up on the fly.
SPEAKER_04It's not, but I just want to like flip the rolls one time.
SPEAKER_03That's fine. I completely get it. It's a little too much power, apparently. Yeah, it's whatever. Anyway, I'm Ross along with me tonight, Phil and Brett, of course. Mailbag episode. Uh, and let's dive right in. Um, let's start with a question that has multiple questions, because why not, right? Here we go. Hey, Hive Mind. I've got a few questions about what you tell your players and what you keep hidden. Uh, I'm just gonna break this down. I'm not gonna give you the whole question. We'll just go one by one. How about that? Okay. So, first question: what do you tell your players off the bat about weapons and armor? If they find and equip a plus one great sword, do you tell them outright that it's a plus one? Or do you wait until they focus on it during arrest and tell them then? Well, damn.
SPEAKER_01Typically we tell them plus one. Like it's a plus one sword or something like that. But if it's like a magical weapon, like if it's imbued with something or you know, something along those lines, sometimes that gets held back.
SPEAKER_04I usually at least require like an arcana check or something for that, but I definitely feel like I just give a bunch of information away most of the time and instead should require more. That's how we all have magical weapons in our way oped and our Yeah, I miss I I've admitted mistakes have been made, okay. We all power creep is real.
SPEAKER_03I mean, I get it though, like to a certain extent, is like if you have like a really good sword that's maybe not super magical by any means, but has some hidden attributes, like you don't want people to just gloss that over though, either.
SPEAKER_04Well, and I also think uh it depends probably who your party members are, because if you have a fighter and they're like looking over weapons, they're going to be more familiar with weapons to identify like a sword that looks better, right? Or of a higher quality or you know, better craftsmanship than sure, you know, your normal sword. So I think in those instances, like that character probably knows. Sure.
SPEAKER_01So on the flip side of that, what about a barbarian picking up a magical long sword or something like that? Where but the barbarian wouldn't necessarily hate knows squat about magic.
SPEAKER_04Sure. I think that's a fun I feel like we should be doing that more often. Like, I think that's fun to play.
SPEAKER_03So here's the hard thing though at higher levels, though. Like, we all have weapons, like it's good to know like is this a weapon that I actually need to keep? Is it better than what I'm carrying now?
SPEAKER_01Because I You've got to drop some hints. Sure. Like you need to say it's more than just a pile of swords. Sure.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, even the barbarian, I feel like maybe when he went to pick it up or something, could feel like something and not know anything about it. There's a buzz with it. Yeah, and even just be like, oh, I don't want this, right? Like it's you know, hand it off to someone else, it doesn't feel right, kind of a thing. Sure. And then to that, I feel like to this question's point, you know, go somewhere where someone can identify it if no one in the party could take it into a city, yeah. Get it appraised.
SPEAKER_03Sure. Yeah. Okay, next question that this person has is what roles do you ask players to do openly in front of everyone? I think this is interesting because at least one I DM, the players roll make all their roles in front of everybody. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04So I think the only time that I wouldn't is if they were trying to do something intentionally they didn't want the rest of the party to know about. Or if I didn't want the rest of the party to know that something was happening. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Or the home rule, homebrew rule that we've talked about before, where you roll death saves privately. Ooh.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, we've never we well, we also haven't gone into death saves, but I do remember that. Class session was close. That's true. Freaking power word kill. Uh actually, I think this is something that we may not do a lot, but it's certainly built into pretty much every platform in the form of whisper roles. So a DM can ask you to do that or whatever the case. I I kind of wish we would do it more, uh, just because I I like the idea of role-playing like you have your own agenda.
SPEAKER_04I feel like I there are certain things I do that could warrant this that I just call for a role that only one person knows about. Like thinking of Matt's character, right, transforming into the werebear. Because I just ask him for a role, and instead of just asking in front of the table, like I should message him just to do it privately. Sure. Like you guys still don't know what it was at the time. He was just doing a random role. Right. But in essence, that's kind of the same thing.
SPEAKER_03That's actually that's actually a really good example because now that we know what it is, it would be more fun for it to happen like without us knowing that it's gonna happen. Exactly. Just hear the roll of dice and then all of a sudden freaking erupts into his bear form. That would be awesome, actually.
SPEAKER_01And that's one advantage of having a virtual tabletop and playing remotely. If you're sitting around a table, you would have to do things differently.
SPEAKER_03Sure. I think they would have to come behind the screen and roll. Like you would just have them come over to you and behind the screen. Or you could set up an area with another screen and say, go roll there and then tell me what you rolled.
SPEAKER_04We have to go into another room. You could do like what Dungeons and Daddies do, and they just make everyone else leave the room except for the one person and like do something like that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, don't worry, we'll probably do that at some point anyway. Uh okay, transversely then, uh, do you openly roll anything or is it all behind the screen for you as the DM?
SPEAKER_01Mostly behind the screen. I think really big roles can be done in front. And it's like here, if you are risking everything, yeah, put it out in front of the table and like let it roll.
SPEAKER_04That's fair. Like that's something that high stakes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Makes sense.
SPEAKER_01And and it only in the circumstances where you are okay with having it go bad. Sure.
SPEAKER_03Sure, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Like if you're going to fudge the role, of course, keep that behind the screen. But if you're okay and the table's okay with the outcome, if it goes poorly, let it roll.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah. I I like that. I think of like situations like arguments where it's just like your charisma versus my charisma. Whoever rolls highest, you know. Let's do it that way.
SPEAKER_04Oh, yeah, that's true.
SPEAKER_03Or something like that. That that would be fun to do out there. Combat, I I am not one to kill my players, or I I just want to give them a challenge. So I'll fudge rolls based on the flow of the combat. Sure, sure. And you never really know it because it's just another round that we went in, because I saved you from creating you and you and combat being over or something like that, right? So uh yeah.
SPEAKER_04I think that's a I like that approach, I think. Like probably not in combat. I don't see myself really doing it in combat unless your combat got to like this apex moment of I I think of like when you guys were trying to redeem Zariel, right? If if she that would have been a contested role between what Ari did versus her, like that is something, even if we were sort of in the pseudo-combat, that's almost a role-playing moment where I feel like stakes are high. Let's roll these two dice and see what happens, right? Like that would have been a good example for that. Um, but yeah, just a standard round of combat, probably not.
SPEAKER_01No, you kind of lose the mystique of it if you do it too much. Yeah, yeah, I agree.
SPEAKER_03Okay, let's so let's go on to the next question. Uh, what is the craziest thing that has happened in one of your games? I love this because this is a chance for us to do some gin inflecting. Hmm.
SPEAKER_01Like great- oh, so many choices.
SPEAKER_03Um I always enjoyed Ari getting struck by lightning. That was fun. That was fun.
SPEAKER_04I love rolling that many dice at once.
SPEAKER_03Um I also love was Tic Tac your character? Was it not Tic Tac? What was the name of Tic Cha Tic Cha sacrificing himself? I I guess that wasn't what was the how was this question phrase the craziest thing? That wasn't crazy, but it was certainly an in probably the most impactful moment of that campaign when he sacrificed himself uh at the end of Flight of Xerxes. Like that was like probably the closest thing to like a tearjerker moment. Uh, because we kind of passed the ball around to who was gonna do it, and then not really knowing what was gonna happen, and then it happened, and then it was like, holy crap. It was it was a good moment.
SPEAKER_01My favorite things are the slow burns, like the it takes multiple sessions to set this up, and nobody else at the table knows it's going down, and then finally the payoff comes through.
SPEAKER_03And what does that have to do with this damn doll that you have?
SPEAKER_01I cannot say, I cannot confirm or deny.
SPEAKER_04I don't know what you're talking about. You don't, I don't, which is probably more scary. I was trying to find in the Light of Azeraxes campaign, at one point you guys are we were in like a Colosseum type battle, and it had something to do with shooting something up the ass. And like, do you remember that? It was the most ridiculous, and I can't think of what the whole thing was.
SPEAKER_03There was like a creature in there, and I think it may have been for I think I did the shooting, like I hopped up on Isaac's on Murgie's back and shot the thing in the ass. I don't know, that was now I have the turn somewhere.
SPEAKER_04I'll have to dig it out.
SPEAKER_01Or putting the immovable rod inside the mouth of a dragon. Yeah, that was always a good one.
SPEAKER_03That was a good one. The immovable rod always causes chaos no matter where it goes or what it does. I love it. Anything else? Any other crazy moments that have popped out?
SPEAKER_04I mean, there was a time that you know Brett's character basically like TPK'd the whole party. Jesus Christ.
SPEAKER_03Like, not even two sessions into like us all playing together.
SPEAKER_01It's there's kind of a theme here. It's like somebody's gonna die when my characters are around.
SPEAKER_03It's pretty damn good.
SPEAKER_01Could be me, could be everybody else.
SPEAKER_04Roadie finished Brutus with a laser bolt up the bunghole.
SPEAKER_03Where it was Roadie, yes. That was such a fun campaign. Okay, so speaking of that, uh, there'll actually be a question probably at some point tonight about a uh uh spell jammer helm showing up. So brace yourselves for that. Somebody we'll get there.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, brush up on your liner's direct.
SPEAKER_03Like I didn't bring that book. Okay. Uh okay, next question. Uh, first time DM here. I could use some advice. I'm having trouble dealing damage to one of my players who is a level three. Here's the situation: his AC is consistently 19 due to the following combination: 10 is a base, plus three from mage armor, plus three from his Dex modifier, plus three from Blade Song. So he must be an elf to have the blade song.
SPEAKER_04Okay.
SPEAKER_03Uh, and then goes, whenever I manage to hit with a 19 or a natural 20, he then uses a reaction to cast shield, bumping his AC to 24. Because of this, he hasn't taken a single point of damage since the start of this campaign.
SPEAKER_04My so f first thing I was thinking is uh you need to start throwing creatures or mobs or something that have multi-attack. Because you can only use one reaction per turn. Yep. So I guess I'd have to look at the rules of shield, though. Is it good for a full turn? I'll have to let me look at shield.
SPEAKER_03So the interesting thing here is I I think you need to keep hitting this player because mage armor and blade song both have to be cast. I think one's a bonus action, one's a reaction. So eventually you're gonna run out of, and I don't think either one of them are cantrip. So I think at some point you're gonna run out of spell slots at level three. You're gonna run out of spell slots. So keep punching, and you'll get there eventually.
SPEAKER_04What's it so they're casting mage armor and is it shield, or what was the second one?
SPEAKER_03Uh because they're a level three elf, I'm assuming. They get that blade song, so they get a plus three to their AC.
SPEAKER_04And that's just constant.
SPEAKER_03It's like a it's for a minute, but they have to cast it, I'm pretty sure. We can look at that.
SPEAKER_04That's a lot of casting. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03One one is a bonus action, one's a reaction. So you technically would be able to do that in a turn.
SPEAKER_01I was just looking up to see if mage armor required concentration, but it does not.
SPEAKER_03It does not. Okay. So that if they if they did both require concentration, that would be an easy fix for that. But either way, with the casting, if you keep punching, you can at least get them down to a 13.
SPEAKER_04But the bonus AC is good until the start of their next turn, too. So yeah.
SPEAKER_03I mean, hit harder? I don't know. I I I I mean, if you're a relatively new DM, he said he's a first team. They said they're a first time DM. Okay. So it could be one of those, you know, I don't want to hit the same player multiple rounds in a row because that seems weird and picking on somebody, but the reality is if they're freaking 19 base, keep punching.
SPEAKER_04Well you have to think too, so a lot of the it it depends obviously like what type of creatures they're coming up against or whatnot, but a lot of them are intelligent beings. So they would potentially be able to suss out like who is the most like if they're shooting someone and they're not taking damage, communicate that to the rest of the group to focus on that person, right? Like sure. They can be strategic. Sure. They don't have to oh be nice, right? Like right. Or find environmental, you know, environmental things maybe that can throw that character off, like put them at a disadvantage somehow. I don't know.
SPEAKER_03For sure.
SPEAKER_01Blow them off a cliff.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_01Like there's ways to damage characters without or like remove them from a battle. Strike them with lightning.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. You know what I love is like we've come so far in playing and just doing this show that they didn't say what the race in class was, but we pretty much narrowed it down that this is a elf mage of some sort. More than likely. Uh yeah. Congrats to us, guys. Congrats to us. That's that's pretty anyway. Uh TLDR, keep punching that person. You'll get through those spell slots. You'll get to them eventually. Uh, next question. Something happened in my last game that caused a TPK, and I'm arguing with the DM over a choice he made. So I want to ask you guys this. The group were ooh, sorry. The group were fighting a monster, and it had a a recharge a recharge of an area of effect spell. Okay. That was pretty much fireball. Uh okay, so long story short, this is homebrew. So I'll try to try and try to decipher this as I go. I apologize. Uh, but basically, TPK happened because the bad guy cast this fireball type spell, but they were stunned. If the monster is stunned, should it be able to skip over it? It should have been able to it should have skipped over its turn, but he's still using his ability to cause party wipe question mark. Sorry, that was long and convoluted.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, let's repeat that one more time. Jesus Christ. The short version.
SPEAKER_03So Big Bad Evil Guy in this situation is stunned, but still took an action to cast this spell, which caused a TPK. My understanding is the stun condition also means that they're incapacitated. If you're incapacitated, you can't take an action. So if they did anything with their turn, that's probably not acceptable.
SPEAKER_04I feel like I had a heads up on this one. I actually read this yesterday. Uh what? I did. You read the doc? No, no, no, no. I I read this. Oh, you read that. I actually saw this post yesterday because I thought through this, I'm like, wow, like how would I handle this? Or like how so I've actually thought about this one a little bit. Um the short answer is that technically the DM can do whatever they want. However, yeah, a stunned character shouldn't be able to roll their recharge. And even if they rolled the recharge and they got it, they still shouldn't be able to use that action because they're incapacitated.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it can't take actions or reactions. Nope.
SPEAKER_04They automatically fail saving throws. Yeah.
unknownYes.
SPEAKER_01Are we good on this one? Oh, I want to go back for a minute. Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_03I I had I had one caveat to this though. Is that you you're arguing your argument here on the stunning is based on, well, A, like you said, it DM can do what they want, but also that's based on rules as written. Once you get into homebrew land, and assuming like these are made up spells that you guys are coming up with, that completely changes the game in a lot of ways, I feel like.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. Like I definitely gave someone power word kill last time we played that can't even cast magic, right? Like, and that's where we're at at this point in the game. But do I think that maybe that was not appropriate? I don't really know because I don't know your table. Would I do that? No, I probably wouldn't do that, but that's me as a DM.
SPEAKER_03Sure. Okay, let's back up.
SPEAKER_01So I'm fixated on this list of 19 armor class from the last question.
SPEAKER_04Okay, yes. Is the math right? Did you check the math?
SPEAKER_01No, I haven't checked the math. But I found a workaround.
SPEAKER_04Okay.
SPEAKER_01Silence. Oh if you cast if you have a uh some sort of wizard cast silence, it would block the shield spell. Yep. At least.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Shield has a verbal.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and the shield is a what a plus five. Plus five. So that's totally actually.
SPEAKER_01It really drops them down.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, that's true. Boy, that just goes back to if you can cast silence on a wizard, you can really F them up. Oh, yeah. They become very squishy. Such a good, good counterattack. I love that. Okay, next question. This one's another more open-ended one. Uh, we could use some advice. We just had session 10 of our weekly game, a homebrew world that I'm DMing and creating. I took some time before the game to ask the players if they were enjoying the world and the plot so far. Overall, comments were good, but two of the younger players thought it was going to be more fun. They mentioned a podcast, I won't mention the name, and want it to be more like that. I listened to a few episodes of their live play. Definitely not my style. I wasn't envisioning our game to be like the three stooges with obnoxious jokes. I don't want to take the attitude of an I'm the DM and what I say goes, but this world that I'm building has a darker theme. Help. I feel like that's something that could have been sorted out in a session zero.
SPEAKER_01That's a session zero problem. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um but it's also not too late to have a session zero again. Yeah. Sure. Yes. Like you, it sounds like they just as a group, right? That party needs to be not outside of a normal game session, have a session zero and say, like, hey, you know, I've been doing this planning. Here is the world. Like, here's where things are going. It is a darker theme, and you know, if that's not what everyone is there for, that's okay. And there's no hard feelings, and they can find a different game, and that's okay. Like, I think you kind of have to get to a point where that would be okay. I mean, everyone's play style is different.
SPEAKER_01I think you need to be open to changing what you're planning on doing as the DM too. Like, don't be too set on railroading, but also a dark campaign can't be dark the entire time. True. Oh, yeah. There has to be some light heartedness to really make the dark spots dark.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_01You have to have an opposite to balance it out.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. You have to be a sassy little toboxy right to Strahd's face.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, and how that turned out for you.
SPEAKER_04Oh, great.
SPEAKER_03He doesn't know about that yet, but he'll find out sooner. In in his defense, you missed a session, so that was your punishment for missing the session.
SPEAKER_04That's fair. It was it's not ideal, but it'll be okay. I at least gave you a way out. That's true.
SPEAKER_03Uh okay, next question. Uh hello. I have a group of roughly 15 people that I DM for regularly. Uh, strangers tell me I'm a good GM. My players think I should do it professionally. I get lots of compliments. What's worse, I kind of believe them. What I'm not achieving as a GM is I'm struggling to leave an emotional impact on players. What do you do to better help impact on your players emotionally? To give them the do you give them the freedom to play, to be afraid, to experience something different, or what?
SPEAKER_04That's a really hard question.
SPEAKER_03I I think that's something that's very hard to do in I I assume this is homebrew. I guess they really didn't say. If you're in a module or in a one-shot, it's really hard to do that because you haven't built connections. Everything's so passive. Like you're coming across this person who just died in the street. Well, you don't care about them. You haven't played with these characters long enough to care if somebody dies off. Once you've played with a group for three to four years, not that doesn't necessarily have to be that, but you develop ties like that that eventually become more impactful when something, anything, happens.
SPEAKER_01I think you need to give the players liberty to develop the world. Yes. Like if they're not affecting the world and they're just Yeah, it's kind of like a video game. If you are forced to go down this path, it's kind of boring. It can be kind of boring. But if you are more of a more open world and the players choose where to go, then they get a little bit more entwined into what is going on. It's choose your own adventure. I go ahead.
SPEAKER_04I think some of it too can be controlled a little bit or suggested a little bit through things like Brett was talking about as far as creating balance between like a darker campaign and some comedic relief. Or like I know a lot of times we try to incorporate you know some form of sound, right? Potentially too, which can like heighten that's senses. Like things and it doesn't have to be complex, right? Like sometimes you just look up something on YouTube that fits a theme, you know, that you're looking for. Are you trying to do that? Yeah. Like are you are you in a pub, right? Look something up, get them in that mindset. Increase the I don't know, the intensity of the music, right? To make it a tense point, like get them on their toes, and then someone you know busts the door down, right? And then people like jump back.
SPEAKER_03It adds depth to your world, yeah. It really immerses you in it, which changes the dynamic.
SPEAKER_01Which also I think don't be afraid to go on side quests. True. Sure. Side quests can give you that freedom to let the players have a little bit more freedom than they typically would have if you're going down your main story arc, but they don't need to know that. Right.
SPEAKER_03I I really liked your point, Brett, about like letting the players create their own connections and letting that play out and develop because it's like when you about TPK does in that dungeon, I don't know if I would have cared if anybody, any of us had died. We were two sessions in. I didn't even know my own character at that point very well. But now we are what three, four years? I don't even know where how long we're down the road, are we? At least three years down the road. I feel like two things would happen if any of us died. One, Phil as the DM would give us a very fitting, very climactic end. And two, like, I truly feel like each of you in character are like brothers to me. Like we've literally been through hell and back. And even though we irritate the hell out of each other, I think any of us would do anything to help the other one. So if somebody died, that would be intense.
SPEAKER_04I think that was evidenced, right, by Everdash, Matt's character, wasn't that last session, two sessions ago, where like Thorne's been a little out of character and like Everdash, which kind of rough character for the most part, but like not very emotional. Not super emotional, but he's like, hey, calling me out. Are you good? Like you seem off, right? And like that level of care of Everdash with Thorne is like, you know, that has taken years to cultivate. Totally.
SPEAKER_03And especially, yeah, and like rough, yeah, but extremely passive to like the world around him. He's he's that brooding guy that really doesn't give a shit. But he apparently notices, and it was a cool ass moment.
SPEAKER_04Like it was it was so well played.
SPEAKER_03That's that's still top 10 moments for sure, probably top five.
SPEAKER_01But also 15 players?
SPEAKER_03I know, yeah, that's a lot. I can't imagine. Well, and it's hard to it. Okay, going back to being immersed, how do you immerse like a combat alone would be such a freaking swatch?
SPEAKER_01I don't think they could be all there at one time. So it's probably a rotating cast at the table, but then you don't necessarily have the same people week to week.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, sure. Again, hard to build connections, yeah. Yeah, people coming in and out. Ooh, that's a qu I I like that question though.
SPEAKER_04Um, I'm trying to think like how you could layers to it. How you could build villains instead, because they could come up against similar villains, and then that is maybe how you could establish those connections.
SPEAKER_03I mean, that could be like uh think think like superheroes, right? So it's like Batman never killed the Joker, so there's a relationship that evolves, yeah, even though they're on opposite sides. So like then you build moments with that, right? If he kills Vicky Vale or whatever.
SPEAKER_01And if you have multiple groups within the same campaign, they could be each going after a different member of a cult. They're like you're working your way up to the high up through the hierarchy of the cult as a collective. Sure.
SPEAKER_03I I think another way you could do it would be to like demonstrate it. So like if you want your players to feel intense moments, create one. Like have an NPC die and have another NPC react vi not violently, but intensely over something that happens there, and then really demonstrate to your players like what could happen. People change when things happen, like demonstrate that and then see what they do when something happens to them. That's a good idea. So anything else on that one? Okay, let's keep going.
SPEAKER_04That one got us going. I did.
SPEAKER_03That was a good one. Okay, uh, if a demon dies in Feyrune and is banished to the abyss for a hundred years, does it mean they can't leave the abyss at all? Or can they not go to Feyrune for a hundred a hundred years? But other planes are fine, question mark. I don't know the exact answer to this. I I feel like this is a Percy Jackson-esque question because the three of us have read those books. But I'm like, if you get banished to the abyss, you are there kinda. I I feel like there's essences, but you're not really able to influence or do anything if you leave the abyss to me. You can whisper in somebody's ear or show your presence, but you can't you can't truly affect any other world because you are a mere piece of what you were, kind of thing.
SPEAKER_01And it really depends on your or the whatever creature you banish there, their power. Totally. Like what level of devil are they?
SPEAKER_03Oh yeah, if we're talking an imp, I think an imp dies outright to me. Yeah. They're reborn somewhere. They get eaten underneath in the abyss. Totally.
SPEAKER_04I don't know. I'm trying to figure out like, but what happens if they're summoned?
SPEAKER_03If they're summoned back, I think that's different, because like if you're doing like a ritual spell and you're summoning them back, then they come back in their their actual form, then. Right.
SPEAKER_01So he's not really like a counter that seems like a counter spell to banishment. Almost would be, in essence.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, that's what I was getting at too.
SPEAKER_04Like I but I think once again, you basically have to have like a cult or something, right? That like followed that demon, they'd have to have enough power. And obviously if you banish. No, nor should it be. I I'm thinking there's but as a DM, if you need to bring one back.
SPEAKER_03Uh I I think there's some information missing from that, because it would be it would be good. If we're talking about like a an archdemon or a pit fiend, I feel like their presence or a god should be easier to bring back or easier to feel the present than any random devil that you killed in the streets kind of thing. Absolutely. There has to be some sort of summons. Uh he said demon. Okay. I mean, I'm assuming both can be banished to the pit. I don't know. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04At this point, Phil, we we've talked about demons go back to the abyss, devils would not. Oh. Right? See, I guess. They're the nine handry lights instead. Okay. They're different.
unknownOh shit.
SPEAKER_04I know. A pit fiend is a devil, it's not a demon.
SPEAKER_02How does this make any sense? Everything in a version of the city.
SPEAKER_04I just say no. All the people out there are gonna call us out. I'm going on the record saying we do know there's a difference.
SPEAKER_03I also feel like we've homebrewed enough shit that like I'm getting like what we confused with like what is actually written in places. I was like, oh my god. Okay, well, let's move on from that one. Uh, I have a player playing a cleric who would rather be a paladin. I'm fine with the switch, but I want to incorporate it somehow into the story. The party's entered Baldur's Gate, his deity is Tear. I told him he needs to pick an oath to be prepared, but I was thinking along the lines that Tyr wants him to go into a run-down tomb uh where I was going to run something like a crypt from Skyrim, where they fight through a couple waves of skeletons, maybe some undead with a with a boss at the end, puzzled door, something. Uh, thoughts on this? Is it effective or is it too much? Question mark. I don't know why I'm saying question mark at the end of these.
SPEAKER_04So we know that you're done.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, there you go.
SPEAKER_01Is this your backstory?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I'm like this. This is not my backstory.
SPEAKER_03I did not switch. Uh, I th I first of all, you're the DM. You do whatever you want. Like, that's what how you want this person to make the switch, go for it. Fine. Uh, I also think you could work in a conversation with Tyr, and Tyr just makes it happen. Because there also is gonna need to be a switch somehow from a wisdom base for your spells to a charisma base. So how is it gonna be have to be? Yeah, but I think you should if you if you're allowing somebody to switch, I think you should give them the opportunity to absolutely, but then you gotta figure out a way to write that in.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because if they've also like leaned their character into wisdom at this point, because that was their spellcasting modifier. Correct.
SPEAKER_03So so, especially if it's early, yeah.
SPEAKER_04Give them an opportunity.
SPEAKER_01That was what I was gonna bring up is how does this affect um the decision if it's like a brand new character that's like two or three sessions in versus like you've been playing this one for three years, right, and then want to make that switch. Correct.
SPEAKER_04Ooh, I mean if they were in like two or three years, I would think Tyr makes a claim. I would do that instead of because they'd be far enough in there, they're they've I would assume if you're two or three years in, how far are we in? Three to four. So you guys would have been at least tenth level by then, and like at that point you've got a little notoriety, like you've got some good stuff, and I think at that point tear's like, yeah, cleric, you're now my champion. It's a conversation, and he makes a claim.
SPEAKER_03I mean, my guess is if you're making the switch, you're probably playing the character as a paladin anyway.
SPEAKER_04You're probably uh most likely yeah, you're just a heavy hitting less smite, a lot less smite.
SPEAKER_03But then but that's that's what you get granted to you is the ability to smite, right?
SPEAKER_01So or it's like do you just multi-class?
SPEAKER_03You could. That's certainly an option.
SPEAKER_01Because you would have a weaker version of it, potentially.
SPEAKER_03I I guess the biggest benefit there is you would have more healing powers as a multi-class cleric paladin, which could be interesting. I don't know. I I think there's lots of things to feel through there. At the end, at the end of the day for this question, do it however you want. It it really doesn't matter. But I think there's other things to think through. That's that's the hardest thing.
SPEAKER_04I don't think there's anything wrong with that plan. I think it's a good plan. And and then would give them, you know, a chance to develop that character too, or like lean into basically turning paladin, right? Like through those waves of enemies or whatever that is, I think that could work out too.
SPEAKER_01Or this could be, yeah, this could also be an entire character arc.
SPEAKER_04True.
SPEAKER_01More than just a one. Yeah, that's true.
SPEAKER_04Maybe they like prove themselves to Tyr. And then at the end of the whole thing, Tyr's like, yes.
SPEAKER_03I guess it depends on how bad you want to be a paladin. Like, do you really want to wait till the end? Or do you just not grant them the ability to change, and then that's the goal for the end.
SPEAKER_00Ooh.
SPEAKER_03So that's something that could be. Ooh, I like it.
SPEAKER_01Uh sorry, we gave you more homework.
SPEAKER_03She's coming out with us on a Monday afternoon. Oh my gosh. Uh, that's a different story for a different day. Uh, next question: another cleric paladin question here that popped up. So my DM suggested my war cleric also become a paladin. So, speaking of multi-classing, now I want to take a feat, but I don't know if I should pick Sentinel or Great Weapon, Great Weapon Master Feat. I think both are great for my character. What would you do? Funny thing is, I have had this, I had to go through this as well. Uh it's hard because great weapon doesn't give you always what you think it's going to give you. So basically, the the first thing it gives you is if you score a crit hit with a melee weapon and or you reduce a creature down to zero hit points, you can basically make another attack, which is whatever, right? That's one one extra attack. The other benefit the great weapon master gives you is you can take a I think it's a plus a minus five penalty to the roll. If you still succeed on the roll, you automatically get 10 more damage. So if you're already a paladin that's dealing 40 damage, you're all of a sudden dealing 50 damage. The sentinel feat. Do you have any thoughts?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, well, my initial thought, this I feel like depends on your party. Ooh, sure. Because you may not have a need to even think about taking great weapon mastery.
SPEAKER_03That's true. But I mean, personally, I wouldn't take it anyway. I don't think there's enough benefit with great weapon mastery.
SPEAKER_04A paladin is a fighting class, yes, but it's also a support class. And like Sentinel leans into that. Yes, kind of both.
SPEAKER_03Like I I mean they're both they're similar because you get essentially the same effect at with the sentinel feet because if you're making a melee, it the difference is with Sentinel is if you're within five feet of an enemy and they attack somebody else, you get to make an opportunity attack. So it's not a full attack necessarily, but you at least get to swing. So you still get that benefit of swinging at somebody when it's not necessarily your turn.
SPEAKER_04And if you hit with that, then their speed becomes zero for the rest of the turn. So they can't like continue to run away. And with that sentinel feet, you get an ability score increase. Either your strength or your decks, you get a bump by one.
SPEAKER_03So you're getting sentinel feet?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I'm reading from the newest, whatever, 2024.
SPEAKER_03Oh, I think that's okay. I was like, that's about how I've been.
SPEAKER_04It's even juiced. That's what I mean. Like, there's no reason not to take Sentinel now because it's juiced in 24.
SPEAKER_03Can I upgrade mine?
SPEAKER_04No. No, you cannot.
SPEAKER_03So so full disclosure, uh, I probably forget to do it half the time anyway, unless I'm like really thinking about it. Because like all of us, I you can do so many things when you get above level 12 that it's like I feel like I spend five minutes planning out my attack because I don't want to forget something, especially if it's a solid enemy. I don't want to forget something that could deal some extra damage.
SPEAKER_01It's like, hey, I remember a thing on my character sheet, but I don't remember what sections it is in. It's scroll, scroll, scroll, scroll.
SPEAKER_03So, case in point on that, not to get too far off track here, was that one of the things Thorn can do as a paladin, it's part of his like channel divinity thing, is like he has like a special spell that would get allow everybody else within that aura to cast an additional five radiant damage on every attack that they make. Every attack, yep, for for a minute. So basically the whole run of a combat, they would get to add that. So think of you know Everdash using his flailed katana.
SPEAKER_04I mean, if you come after Everdash in the initiative order, you may as well not plan out your turn.
SPEAKER_03That is no shit.
SPEAKER_04Sorry, Matt. That is no shit. You could just deal so much damage, it's ridiculous.
SPEAKER_03So I guess I didn't realize that they had they had up that. Yeah. Um, so that's pretty damn cool too.
SPEAKER_04Agreed. So I would pick Sentinel.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, that's how I was leaning anyway, and I didn't even know about that.
SPEAKER_04It says I can increase my decks. You better believe I'm gonna take Sentinel.
SPEAKER_03Sorry.
SPEAKER_04Wrong class.
SPEAKER_03Uh okay, one last question, and then I think that's that's about good for one night. Uh, here we go. Just got to debate, just got into a debate with one of my players about the fact that no, your sixth-level artificer cannot defeat the god of death and chaos in one battle. I don't care if he only has 5,000 followers and ascended 150 years ago. He is a god. All capital letters. This is the same player who tried to take over DM mean a few sessions ago, and he's defending his opinion fiercely. My entire world is homebrewed, including the deities, and I incorporated the idea that deities become more or less powerful depending on how many followers that they have. Also, a very similar Percy Jackson type rule. Uh, this particular deity has uh is an ascended archdemon. Not really a question here, just more of uh what thoughts do you have on this?
SPEAKER_01I tend to agree with Aim. So the what was it? The artificer wanted to defeat?
SPEAKER_03The the artificer is a level six, he thinks he can take down a god in a one-on-one battle. At level six. One-on-one battle? So it's it says one-on-one.
SPEAKER_01I mean, you can try.
SPEAKER_04No.
SPEAKER_03Yep.
SPEAKER_04This sounds like a great opportunity to wipe that player off of the map. That's what I think.
SPEAKER_03I think this is a great opportunity for a DM to say, hold my beer. Yeah, exactly. Uh at the end of the day, you can make that god however powerful you want.
SPEAKER_04So no, you guys are level 15 characters, and I wouldn't let a one of you take on a god as a single entity, maybe as a group, and I'd probably wipe you.
SPEAKER_03But yeah, right. What what who was the god who was the god in the dream that tried to take us out? I know.
SPEAKER_04I've already thinking that through, okay. But it wasn't his full power.
SPEAKER_02Zariel had to intervene on his behalf early, otherwise, we were gonna wipe his shit off the map.
SPEAKER_04Exactly. Fair, not devil.
SPEAKER_03I'm not gonna hear the end of that one. Nope. What thoughts do you have, Brett? You look very inquisitive over that.
SPEAKER_01I'm trying to figure out what where the player's coming at from this to try to justify this.
SPEAKER_04I think even if you weakened it down as like it being down to a demigod, you could still say you can try, but I still don't think that I let that character win. Sure. Maybe make it close.
SPEAKER_03But I think I think kind of the point is here is he's trying to establish that this person has had some not positive interactions with him, uh, especially since he tried to take over DMing. Uh so I think this is just a nice thing.
SPEAKER_04That's a hard situation too, though, because if you do like agree to the one-on-one battle, and then you're just kind of flying by the cuff, and that person who's trying to take over DMing is like a rules lawyer, like that's not gonna go well either.
SPEAKER_01But I you know I have a feeling this is not a D discussion.
SPEAKER_03This is there's something else. Yeah, there's undertones, aren't there? Yeah. Maybe this person shouldn't be at your table, and you may want to reach out.
SPEAKER_01You need to have some conversations to maybe that person needs to go DM their own table.
SPEAKER_04Possibly.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, and let that party take on gods, and then he wipes them out because he is God. He is God, yeah. Uh, any other thoughts or questions you guys have maybe come across before we get out of here? Out in the wild? I don't know if you've heard some good questions for us. I'm giving you an open an open invitation here.
SPEAKER_01Ah, we'll have to save it for next time. Yeah, it'll be in the we'll do that next time.
SPEAKER_03All right. Well, that's gonna do it for this episode of Bards and Barrels. You can listen to past episodes of the show anywhere podcasts can be found. You can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Threads, Blue Sky Social, and YouTube at Bards and Barrels. We'll see you soon.
